SteveZ - Posted - 06/14/2014:  06:44:23

My youngest granddaughter (age 12) decided that the older granddaughter (age 15) was getting more of my attention, as the older is a pretty good (better than me) guitarist.  So, the younger decided that showing interest in mandolin would shift the attention scales.  As a result, the younger got a Rover RM-50 with light strings I had, plus a couple books and CDs to assist in the learning process.

Well, that was a few months ago, and the younger's progress (which has included one-on-one time with me) has been very slow.  The major complaint has been finger pain, since the mandolin gets hit-and-miss attention during the week because of all the othef distractions normal to a 12-year-old.

Well, thought I'd add a twist to her mandolin education.  I had tuned an inexpensive ($35) soprano ukulele to GDAE as an "alternative travel mandolin.". The feel is a lot softer with the nylon strings, and the size/weight is a lot smaller.  Since it is GDAE, all of the chord patterns, fret assignments and overall left-hand work matches the "learn the mandolin" books.  In other words, it's a mando training aid/device.

It seems to be working.  The older is reporting that the younger spends a lot more time with the "training device" and then occasionally picks up the Rover for confirmation of learning.  

Edited by - SteveZ on 06/14/2014 06:44:49

TSSN - Posted - 06/16/2014:  04:14:33

Sounds like a good deal all around.  There are two more young ladies with an appreciation for our chosen addictions.

I guess I really need to rethink the ukelele.  Your stories have been eye-opening.  My desire to keep mandolin strings on mandolins, guitar strings on guitars, etc, was borne more of a desire not to damage instruments with the wrong string tension (and also,in other words, a kind of laziness).  I got quite the education when I wanted to put GHS Silk and Steels on a mandola, both here on the MHO, and from the mandola builder.  It costs a little extra, but it can be done.  Your uke approach to the mandolin could work for my 7 year old, who thinks from time to time he wants to play my mandolins.... 

SteveZ - Posted - 06/16/2014:  06:55:46

Taking a $30 soprano ukulele, putting $6 worth of strings on it can save a valuable mandolin.  With the 7 year-old, that would give the child an instrument he (or she?) could handle (light, small) and he could mimic your chord patterns as you show him the pattern on your mandolin.

Now for my next experiment - am finding the right combination of nylon strings for a mandolin.  Am using my Burgess fkat-top for this action.  So far I've matched the G A and E, with a nylon wound G (.033"), a nylon A (50 lb test monofilament, .029"), and a nylon E (20 lb test monofilament, .018").  So far I haven't had to modify the nut or bridge (has a low action anyway), and the sound at this point is not half-bad. Just need to find the last piece of the puzzle.

Edited by - SteveZ on 06/16/2014 06:59:23

TSSN - Posted - 06/17/2014:  04:15:56

I'd like to know how it turns out...

So, to be clear, you didn't change out the strings on the soprano uke, you just retuned it?

SteveZ - Posted - 06/17/2014:  05:38:54

On the Soprano I put on the Aquila 30U string set.  Elderly and others sell it.  This set is made for tuning soprano ukes GDAE.  You have to be r e a l l y gentle in tuning the E as it is very thin (have snapped two).  However, once they have stabilized (a day or two) on the uke, they wear like iron and stay in tune.  If the E string snaps, my alternative is 20pound test monofilament fishing line (Walmart discount @ $2.90 fior a 100yard spool.  

TSSN - Posted - 06/19/2014:  20:34:12

Noted.  I'll give it a go.  Thanks.

christym - Posted - 11/20/2014:  10:44:23

quote:

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Originally posted by SteveZ

 

On the Soprano I put on the Aquila 30U string set.  Elderly and others sell it.  This set is made for tuning soprano ukes GDAE.  You have to be r e a l l y gentle in tuning the E as it is very thin (have snapped two).  However, once they have stabilized (a day or two) on the uke, they wear like iron and stay in tune.  If the E string snaps, my alternative is 20pound test monofilament fishing line (Walmart discount @ $2.90 fior a 100yard spool.  

 

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Hi SteveZ,

First, let me say thanks for posting your findings on gdae-tuned ukuleles.  I'm looking to do the same for practicing fiddle melodies (in a quieter way, and to give my neck a break from playing the fiddle).  Anyhow, your posts have been super helpful. I just have a few questions:

First, I'm deciding between the Aquila fifths strings and the 20lb fishing line, and wonder, how did you find that the 20lb fishing line was suitable for the E string?  And do you have any idea how the tension compares to the Aquila E5?  I'm a little concerned about trashing the uke bridge.

Second, I saw another post in which you mentioned trying a modified fifths tuning on a travel uke, tuning to E4 instead of E5 ( mandohangout.com/topic/38749 ).  How is the modified tuning working out for you?  Does it throw you off to hit the lower notes on the the E-string when you're accustomed to hearing notes an octave higher?  Or is it acceptable to your ears and playing experience?

Thanks again,

Christy

Edited by - christym on 11/20/2014 10:47:23

SteveZ - Posted - 11/20/2014:  15:32:20

Christy,

There's a uke board (ukulele underground) and I found a lot of good info there buried in their okd posts.  It led me to the fishing line alternatives including a chart matching various line (by test weight and diameter) to notes.  Most nylon strings are nothing but fishing line or fishing line hybrids, so using the line just makes sense.  20-lb test matches by diameter to what a lot of makers sell as uke E5.  Have never had a tension problem or damage.  That darned Aquila E5 snaps too easily.

I have been doing a lot of experimenting, and have set up all my ukes to CGDA (mandola and tenor guitar tuning),  Aquila's 31U string set works well.  Just to screw things up more, have done reentrant CGDA (C4 instead of C3) and it works well on the smaller ukes.  Any standard Uke low-G GCEA string pack works well by 1) swapping the G and C strings so the C is on top, 2) detuning the E to D,and 3) tuning the A as normal.  That keeps the lower three strings in melodic line and makes picking easier.  It more-or-less fifths and the chord fingering is CGDA-normal.

Don't know how you have found it, but to me the E5 on a uke sounds a bit screechy, which is why I tried (and like) CGDA.  It takes advantage of available strings packages, keeps the uke in a sound range for which it was designed, and still allows the uke to follow "mandolin" chord fingering for reinforcement (although the GDAE G is the CGDA C, and everything else follows that progression).

christym - Posted - 11/21/2014:  11:44:14

quote:

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...Just to screw things up more, have done reentrant CGDA (C4 instead of C3) and it works well on the smaller ukes.  Any standard Uke low-G GCEA string pack works well by 1) swapping the G and C strings so the C is on top, 2) detuning the E to D,and 3) tuning the A as normal.  That keeps the lower three strings in melodic line and makes picking easier.  It more-or-less fifths and the chord fingering is CGDA-normal...

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Thanks for the response, Steve, and for the extra info on string tension (20lb line, etc).

Also, I like the idea of using the more readily available, std (lowG), set of strings to tune to "reentrant fifths" (hi-CGDA).  I'll give it try :)