slickyinc - Posted - 12/30/2010:  10:58:30

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Hey guys, im sure I will take a beating for this question, but I have to ask.
I bought a mandolin last year. Its a epiphone mm-30/as. I really have been wanting to learn how to play it.
I think I could learn it if I had a better understanding of why, when, where.
What is the theory behing it?
The why im talking about is. Why do you play cords, what are they?
How do you apply them to a song, or are they just for practice?
Im totally green to this and need all the help I can get.
I dont have anyone to help me with all of this. Im just going to learn this on my own.
Any help teaching would be greatly appreciated.

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Edited by - slickyinc on 12/30/2010 11:08:10

Texasbanjo - Posted - 12/30/2010:  11:08:51

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There are dozens of FREE music theory sites on the web -- just search for "music theory" and you'll learn all about chords, what they are, how to apply them, etc. Most music theory is for piano or guitar -- but theory is theory and it'll work for mandolin.

There are also lots of theory books out there to purchase -- there's "Mujsic Theory for Dummies" which starts you out with the basics and goes from there. And you'll find literally hundreds of other books out there.

You might want to take a look at my Banjo Music Theory 101 on the Banjo Hangout. It's for banjo, but the concepts can be used for mandolin, too.

And you won't take a beating for your question. We all had too start somewhere and most of us didn't know anything about theory when we began playing either.

mandogryl - Posted - 12/30/2010:  11:14:05

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I think you should ask yourself what genre of music you are interested in playing. (Bluegrass, folk, old-time, classical, Celtic, etc. etc.)
After that, you should know that you can learn either by 'tabs', or standard notation. (There are charts for chords that are good to learn as well.)
There are advantages to both. Tabs can literally be learned over-night, whereas it will take longer time, and maybe an instructor, to learn to read notation. Reading notation will open more music to you, but, depending on what genre you are interested in, there is alot of Tab out there. Tab (tablature) basically has four lines going horizontally across the page of music, and the top line is the E-pair, then the second is the A-pair, third is the D, and the bottom line is the pair of G's. Then you would see numbers progressing from left to right on those lines which tells you which fret is to be played. That is it in a nutshell. I can tell you that if you play alot, your fingertips will develope callouses, which is good; we musicians pride ourselves on our callouses.
Anyway, if you can find someone to get you started that would be great. There are some books on the subject of learning just about any instrument.
Good luck, and let us know how it is going for you, and don't hesitate to ask more questions

Mandolin Ant - Posted - 12/30/2010:  11:57:41

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quote:

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Originally posted by slickyinc

Hey guys, im sure I will take a beating for this question, but I have to ask.
I bought a mandolin last year. Its a epiphone mm-30/as. I really have been wanting to learn how to play it.
I think I could learn it if I had a better understanding of why, when, where.
What is the theory behing it?
The why im talking about is. Why do you play cords, what are they?
How do you apply them to a song, or are they just for practice?
Im totally green to this and need all the help I can get.
I dont have anyone to help me with all of this. Im just going to learn this on my own.
Any help teaching would be greatly appreciated.

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First, good for you for wanting to learn to play the most incredible, wonderful, and facinating instrument in the World!
Mandolin is a great Music maker. You can play chords, strummed or chopped, for accompaniment. You can play melodies (like you would in fiddle tunes). You can play breaks or leads. You can play melodic "highlights" or rhythmic lead type parts to accent accompaniment or runs to highlight transitional parts in a song. In short, you can every chord there is, and some that aren't used a lot that really accentuate songs. It is one the most versitile isnstruments out there.

It really depends on your style, type of music, and what you want to do. Personally, I started learning the basic chords in first position. G, D, A, E, F, C, Am, Em, Dm, etc. All of these chords can be found easily online (here's a great one that will show you the basic chords howardknight.net/mandolin/) You'll find as you go, the voicing of the chord you choose (and there are MANY) will depend on the sound you're after, and where you are on the fret board, etc.
Hope this helps.

Bottom line, start easy and continually challenge yourself. Good luck and enjoy!

Susan H - Posted - 12/30/2010:  14:55:11

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I will echo Texasbanjo's committs. Plenty of sites to help with that. Thomas P. Ohmsen wrote a wonderful book for mandolin called, "Music Theory for Modern Mandolin". It discusses chords and has many chord charts in there. Jethro Burns' book on mandolin also discusses chords in his book. But, mostly 2 and 3 finger chords. While the mandolin is a melody instrument, it does do alot of backup in a group and knowing chop chords is a big plus. Chords are your building blocks. So start with 2 finger chords and work your way up from there. Good luck.

Philphool - Posted - 12/31/2010:  05:05:47

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Are you absolutely sure there's nobody around near you who plays and could help?
I just ask this because that's what I would have said a few years ago when I started, but after getting started and asking around, I found that there were more "closet pickers" hiding nearby than I would have guessed.

I now get out to several jams every week that I had no idea existed!! And most of us at the jam are not "old timers" when it comes to playing, so we help each other learn as we go.

Does your username imply that you're in NC?

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Edited by - Philphool on 12/31/2010 05:07:59

kennyb - Posted - 12/31/2010:  06:23:46

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As already mentioned, there are lots of resources available on music theory.
With regard to chords, the mandolin is not the easiest instrument to learn the theory behind them, because the tonal interval between strings is fifths, i.e. if one string is considered the root note or first note, the next higher string is the fifth note of the given scale. (It would have been so much easier if people had started counting with the number zero, but I digress.) The basis of any chord is the first, third, and fifth note from a starting point within a scale, and the interval between mandolin strings forces us into one of several chord inversion (first, third and fifth in a different order) or a really long finger spread.
Studying chords on a piano, guitar, banjo etc to start with makes things a bit easier,

slickyinc - Posted - 12/31/2010:  16:49:01

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Thanks Guys for all your replies. Some very good info from everyone. I will be looking to get the Music theory for dummies, and Music Theory for Modern Mandolin very soon. As far as the links some provided. They are very informative and helpful. Philphool Im located in TN. Im sure there are some around here that pick, but as you said most are older.
Please dont stop replying to this thread, im sure there are others like me that need all the info they can get.
Thanks again.

mandoteacher - Posted - 01/03/2011:  08:29:43

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Lots of great answers here. I wanted to mention that I offer private mandolin lessons both here in my studio and online through a webcam for those that can't travel to MA. Anyway, lots of great answers!

sweetmusicstudio.net/lessons.html

Flivver - Posted - 01/04/2011:  23:05:01

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Hey Slickyinc,


For over 30 years I was a strummer (guitar) who knew some chords and could sing a little bit. Then when I was 55 I decided I wanted to learn to pick a bit so I went to the library. I am now 57 and have a much better understanding but still have a long way to go!

What helped me turn the corner was a book by Robert Lilienfeld called "Learning to Read Music". IMHO the most important thing is to learn the musical alphabet which consists of 12 notes. Secondly is the concept of pitch. Thirdly is the standard tuning of your instrument; in this case the mandolin which is GDAE (from string 4 to string 1). Memorize the standard tuning! Then learn how the musical alphabet progresses. Learn what whole steps and half steps are. Once you learn all that you will see the fretboard in a whole new way! There is a lot more but I feel these are the basics. Then learn about the major and minor scales and chord construction. All you experienced musicians on this forum please correct me if you feel I have misled this young man! You ain't gonna hurt my feelings! You're gonna have so much fun when you learn this stuff!

bj - Posted - 01/05/2011:  08:47:16

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There are three ways to learn to play--

Ears

Tab

Dots and theory

Some people do well one way, some another, some need all three. We all learn differently. If you have the aptitude for either of the first two, then they'll be the faster way into actually playing a tune or two, but some people need the structure within which to conceptualize what's actually going on and need the dots and theory. Figure out which way you learn and plot your path. You can always add the other bits on later. Good to have all the pieces, but that doesn't mean you'll always use 'em all.

DaddyJ - Posted - 01/05/2011:  12:32:44

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There are a variety of ways to learn, you just have to pick the way that’s right for you and commit to it.

The first thing is, no matter what you end up doing, USE A METRONOME! Period. 20 years from now, if you’re still playing, you should still be using a metronome when you practice. I can’t stress this enough. If you don’t have one yet, you can use this one. It’s free, no download necessary. We used it for a year before we bought a portable one and it worked great.

If I was teaching myself from scratch, I know exactly how I'd do it. Take what you will from this but this method does work if you have the discipline to stick with it. I only wish I'd learned this way.

I firmly believe in using some type of method book. A good method book will start you off easy, and gradually increase the level of difficulty with every piece, introducing new concepts and techniques which build on what you’ve already learned. I recommend Mel Bay’s Complete Mandolin Method. Work your way through the entire book, making sure you get each exercise down pat before moving on to the next one. Prepare to spend a week or more per page as you get into the more advanced stuff. This will be a long-term endeavor. If you are thorough, you could spend a year or more working through this book, give or take depending on how quickly you pick things up. REMEMBER TO USE THE METRONOME.

Concurrently with the above, start working on fiddle tunes. When learning a fiddle tune, learn the chords first and then start on the melody. There is a huge variety of instructional material, jam tracks, etc. out there to help you with this. I would stay away from tab as much as possible. Rely on standard notation and your ear. Don’t get me wrong, tab is useful, but there are some huge advantages to being able to sight read standard notation and too much reliance on tab will severely hinder you in that area. Make it a goal, at the end of the first year, you will be able to play 10-20 fiddle tunes clean, without mistakes, at a decent speed. 144 bpm (where each beat equals a half note) is a good goal. MAKE SURE YOU SPEND TIME LISTENING TO THE TUNES YOU ARE LEARNING! You need to be able to hear the tune in your head while you're playing it.

Concurrently with the above, get yourself a good scale book and start learning scales. Practice them every day.

Once you have a few fiddle tunes under your belt, find yourself a good jam and/or start playing with other people as much as possible. You will learn things from other pickers that you won’t find in any book.

Let’s say you could commit to an hour and a half a day practicing. You could organize your practices something like this:

15 min – Scales
30 min – Mel Bay
30 min – New fiddle tune(s)
15 min – Practice old fiddle tunes to keep them sharp

If you do that for a year you should have an excellent foundation to work from and you will have a fairly comprehensive knowledge of the instrument. Then you can get started really learning how to play.

Mandolin Ant - Posted - 01/07/2011:  08:12:23

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Good point about the metronone. I have an old friend that learned guitar strickly from TAB. He can play all the notes, but has zero sense of rhythm. Most of the time, you can't even tell what song he is playing. I learned mostly from marching band. Playing in step to the beat of your march really hammers home the importance of rhythm and structure in music.

majikgator - Posted - 01/12/2011:  07:55:14

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Tab does indicate rhythm or at least all the tabs i have encountered, metronomes are good but totally inflexible, playing with other musicians or against a rhythm track is a bit more forgiving and more fun - have fun no matter what or you probably won't play for long. haven't found a loud enough software metronome for me yet as a free download, i could use something on a level with my playing volume especially on banjo.

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Edited by - majikgator on 01/12/2011 08:01:23

majikgator - Posted - 01/12/2011:  08:14:41

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i like these mandolin chord links better mandolincafe.com/cgi-bin/chords/ch.pl and mandolinchords.net/ myself and they don't even show nearly all the chord voicings. That was an unusual C chord for a first choice on the site above, the howardknight one.